A conversation with Manuel Mendez on immigration, Afro Latinidad and colorism
By hola | Published | No Comments
Manuel Mendez is the president and chair of the D.C. Afro Latino Caucus, a local organization that focuses on Afro Latinos in the community. The caucus highlights the Afro Latino presence and tells the community’s stories as part of its mission “to bring visibility to and improve the quality of life to Afro Latinos in Washington, D.C.”
Recently, Manuel Mendez dropped by Hola Cultura’s SPEL program to talk about colorism and its complexities, as well as Afro Latinidad. He shared his personal and candid story as an Afro Latino man and dissected how U.S. and Latin American societies often interpret language and color when it comes to Afro Latinos.
As part of our discussion, Mendez also shared some thoughts on Haiti, a country that has been in the news lately and shares the Caribbean island of Hispaniola with his home country, the Dominican Republic.
Ramona: So, would you say that we, Afro Latinos, are both
Manuel: I don’t say I’m both, but some folks do because they don’t want to negate one or the other — Latino or Black. Because I live in Chocolate City … you have to understand my lived experience in Chocolate City. Black people embraced me. I didn’t feel the difference. With my brothers and sisters in Central America, that’s when I really felt the difference. But I went to majority black schools — elementary school, middle school. I did something different in high school, but [by then,] I already knew my blackness was firm.
Sí, soy Dominicano. My nationality is Dominican. That’s my thing. Some people feel there’s a Latino culture that they embrace and a Black culture they also want to be part of. I feel the same in Dominican spaces and in a Black community. I say, “Yo soy negro” (I am Black), letting the chips fall where they may. Race is a social construct, right? What you call yourself is political. To say that I’m Black — that I’m an African man — is a political stance. It’s by choice because I want to embrace my ancestors, who [some] people do not want to acknowledge.
Ramona: What about the Black people who say, “No, you’re Black, you are not Latino?” Or other Black people who say, “No, you’re Dominican, you’re not Black?”
Manuel: Yeah, that’s an inner conversation that we have all the time. There’s a lot of education that needs to happen. I always say that American education has crippled Black folks intentionally because they don’t want to allow us to have that connection. They don’t want us to say we’re cousins. They don’t want us to have that camaraderie. African-American culture might be different from Dominican culture. Brazilian culture is different from Dominican culture. Mexican culture is different from Dominican culture. So, it’s like, when we talk about cultures. Yes, we’re culturally different. Pero nuestra experiencia (But our experience) as Black people is the same. We are always at the bottom.
Sahara: You mentioned that Haitians aren’t really considered Latino. I wasn’t aware of that. They were colonized by the French but share the same island with the Spanish-speaking Dominican Republic. I think the culture is not going to know that political boundary. I’ve always wondered, do Haitians consider themselves Hispanic? What’s the culture there?
Manuel: I don’t think it’s necessarily Hispanic. Hispanic is different from Latino. Supposedly a Latino is from Latin America, regardless of race. Brazilians are considered Latino [but] they speak Portuguese. So, it has nothing to do with language. Some folks do not consider Haitians to be Latino or Latinx, [but] if Brazil is a Latino country, why isn’t Haiti one too?
We consider Brazil a Latino nation, but don’t consider Haiti one. So, in reality, it has nothing to do with language.
Ramona: Would you say that Haitians are Afro Latinos?
Manuel: Yes. That’s what Afro Latino means. We are Black folks from Latin America. The debate is [about] the complexity of Blackness in Latin America and what Black is in the United States. Son dos cosas diferentes (They’re two different things).
Julia: Do people tend to cherry pick what defines Latinidad?
Manuel: It’s about the phenotype. When we consider (what) Latino is in the mainstream, what we considered Latino is a completely white person. This is what I say to folks in the mainstream of Latinidad: “If we are Latino no matter our race, why is it that we only see white faces?” White faces everywhere, whether it is in a local organization, a national organization, on TV or corporate commercials. It’s all white Latinos [when] Latin America has a diversity of beautiful faces. Latinidad has to reckon with the fact that indigenous and Black faces are never placed upfront.
Ramona: The starkly different receptions received by Afghan and Haitian refugees fleeing deadly conditions in their homelands has been a source of controversy. Can you tell us concretely why you think the U.S. government is letting in Afghan immigrants while deporting the vast majority of Haitians?
Manuel: The Afghan families that are coming as refugees are the folks who helped the United States. Haiti as a country is devastated. There’s no political power, no social order. There’s gang violence everywhere. Whenever Black folks request asylum, they don’t get it. They get deported back to their country, [even] when folks tell them, “I’m going to get killed if I go back to my country,” they get shipped back to their countries.
Talia: Do you think the long history of colonialism and colorism in Latin countries shapes the perception and the definition of what people consider Afro Latino? How do you think that affects how being Afro Latino is talked about?
Manuel: One way I can explain it is that we get ridiculed as soon as we put a little bit of flavor into this dry language. The Dominicans get bullied because we eat our ‘R’s’ y nos ponemos la ‘Ll’ (And we add in the ‘Ll’). [Language] affects how we think. It affects what we become [and] what we think we want to become. It affects who we want to be in relationships with. It’s interpersonal too.
Having an afro or locs (dreadlocks): Is it bad hair? That [idea] is part of colonialism as well. It’s a mental thing, not only about what’s happening outside but en nuestra mentalidad (in our mentality). Most of the time, we have issues with hair. We have issues of relationships, with [our] love life — about “mejorando las razas” (“improving the races”) because we want lighter skinned children or we want their hair to be better. It’s one of the ways [neocolonial ideas creep in] where you don’t even think colonialism is a part of it, right?
Manuel: Bueno gracias, gracias a todos. Thank you for taking the time to talk to me. I hope it was informative. And I will do this anytime you guys want.
Afro-Latino Experience group: Thank you for always making yourself available to have these enlightening conversations that take on taboo topics.
— by SPEL’s Afro-Latino Experience story team members
Ramona Santana, Lizzett Garcia, Sahara Ukaegbu, and Talia Jackson
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